How to Drive 70% Direct Bookings: Strategies for Hotel Investors | Kerri Gibson E10

Michael Russell 0:00

The fact is, relying on Airbnb, Expedia, or Booking.com is costing you thousands of dollars and lost revenue every year. If you're like most hospitality operators, you may feel trapped paying OTA fees that drain your profits. However, today's guest has cracked the code to breaking free, building a business where 70% of bookings come direct. On this episode of the Hotel Investor Playbook, we sit down with Carrie Gibson, founder of Chalitz Hooge. After burning out from a corporate career, Carrie channeled her passion for hospitality and sharp attention to detail into a thriving small business. With six successful short-term rentals and a boutique motel, Carrie shares the exact strategies she's used to reduce her reliance on OTAs, cultivate a loyal guest base, and drive direct bookings. From setting up your Google business profile to leveraging influencer marketing to crafting a brand that stands out, this episode is packed with actionable advice to help you maximize revenue and build a thriving hospitality business. Let's dive in. Welcome to the Hotel Investor Playbook, your guide to building wealth and freedom through boutique hotel ownership. Hosted by Mike and Nate. Get in the game. We currently own $30 million of real estate and are documenting our journey towards building a $400 million business. On today's episode, we got Carrie Gibson. Carrie, welcome to the show.

Kerri Gibson 1:50

Hi guys. Thanks for having me.

Michael Russell 1:53

Yeah. Yeah, we're stoked to have you. You're in the business of hospitality, and a big distinguishing factor of what you do is providing an experience that is um above and beyond what you would find just at a general hotel, motel, like you know, uh a commodity hotel. And this is important because you've had tremendous success in driving direct bookings. In fact, 70% of your bookings come direct. And what we want to know is how were you able to accomplish this?

Kerri Gibson 2:26

Oh goodness. So great question. And I think everyone says that to all questions. It's obligatory, but honestly, driving direct bookings is a multifaceted approach. There's not just one silver bullet to having it. It's not just having a PMS, it's just not having a website. There's all these different pieces that have to come together, all the way from your tech stack and what you choose to your social media, to your marketing strategy, and most importantly, your brand. And so it really requires a focus on that and all of those pieces weave together to drive a direct booking strategy. So I started building my direct book strategy lately in 2019, got really serious about it in 2020, but we did not hit the 70% mark consistently. And I say consistently because COVID changed anything, everything, but until 2023. And so we're going on our second year of non-pandemic, you know, all living in some kind of, you know, alternate universe of travel of hitting 70% direct bookings. And so it really took me three and a half to four years to get to that number sustainably and organically. So it is something that requires, like I said, that multifaceted approach.

Nathan St Cyr 3:50

Yeah. So can I call a timeout there and just you you mentioned multifaceted and then you just went boom, you crushed through like the intent. I'm like, I didn't write fast enough to take notes. I'm like, oh. So but can we can we go back and just kind of let's go through those specific points that you said because we want to dig into them, but let's just start with the summary of the points that you said, and and we'll start the the multifaceted approach. Let's categorize those. So, what are the categories that you see as hey, you can't just do one of these things, it's investing energy into each one of them. But let's just go through those.

Kerri Gibson 4:29

Oh, I love that. I have never gone through it from this approach. So, yes, let's do that. You're gonna make me think.

Nathan St Cyr 4:37

All right. So named off, you're like machine gunning.

Kerri Gibson 4:42

I'm like, I'm sorry. I get so excited about this.

Nathan St Cyr 4:47

It was great, but I want I want to slow it down because this is look, this is gold. I mean, we've done math on on we've had a 12% increase in direct bookings. Now we see about $2.5 million worth of revenue. But if you go and and look at that number and you're like, holy crap, that's $300,000 of revenue that we generate that we're not having to pay 15 to 20% fees on. And and so we've done the math ourselves and we're like, man, we've increased it 12%, but we went from 24 to 36. But man, if we could get to 50, if we could, how do we get that number up? So we want to dive in and really learn from you here. So let's go through those those points that you made. Just first of all, let's start with the list, and then from there, I think Mike will have some specific questions he wants to ask in each one of them.

Kerri Gibson 5:42

Absolutely. So, number one is your tech stack, building your tech stack. And that is something, because my background is in technology. Um, I worked for a tech company for 22 years. It's something that came pretty naturally to me, but I know it's pretty intimidating to a lot of people. But really sitting down and thinking about not just where your business is today, but where you want it to go. And that doesn't mean you have to have every little thing to find. But you know, you can even say as broad as I have one short-term rental today, or I have one investment property, but in five years, I want to have six, I want to have seven, or I want to have a motel. So that can help you frame an idea of what kind of technology you're looking for. Because the most important decision that you're going to make technology-wise, to support your business is your PMS. And if you are not clear on where you want your business to be, you're at risk for having to change your PMS down the road. And that's a very painful process because it's going to be the heart and soul of your tech stack, of your business if built right. And so having to unravel that could be a significant amount of work. So when people come to me about building the tech stack, I tell them to really think about what they need from their PMS.

Michael Russell 6:59

When you say PMS, just for the listening, what is a PMS?

Kerri Gibson 7:03

A pro a property management system. So that's gonna be like some companies you hostfully logify, um, host away. There's so many of them out there. There are hundreds of PMSs out there. You know, there's definitely some best in breeds, but understanding the strengths and weaknesses of each versus what you need out of it is super important because there is no such thing as the perfect PMS. There's no such thing as the perfect tech stack, but there is the right one for your business that is going to allow you to mold and grow and adapt with your business. And one of the beauties of hospitality is all of us have the ability to build a unique business based off of our, our, our interests, our passions, our customer bases, our guest bases. And so that's where taking the time to really understand and build out your tech stack is super important. It's not a decision I would rush into overnight or an emotional decision I would make based off of just like having an amazing conversation with a sales rep from a company.

Nathan St Cyr 8:11

So but I want to I want to just dig in there because you're saying that the tech stack is really important. But what we're trying to, what I'm trying to connect the dots to is how does your PM, what PMS system that you choose, how is that going to end up tying in and relate to direct bookings?

Kerri Gibson 8:30

So your PMS is what is going to drive your property listing, your engagement with your direct book website, your engagement with the OTA, such as Airbnb, VRBO, where booking.com, wherever you list, it's going to be your single source that you use to manage your properties and your guests, no matter which channel you're going out onto. And so from there is where you're also going to. So not only are you defining like what's going to be, let's say your database of your properties and your database of your guests, your CRM, it's also going to be what it in what the software that engages with the other pieces of your business. So your marketing component, your guest experience component, your business operations component.

Nathan St Cyr 9:21

Okay, great. And do you use the same PMS for your short-term rentals as you do for your new motel?

Kerri Gibson 9:30

I would love for the answer to that to be yes, but the answer to that is no. And that is because the market is just starting to get where short-term rental owners are crossing over into boutique motels and somewhat vice versa. And how you manage the bookings for a short-term rental versus a motel is very different. And I'm just learning all of this.

Michael Russell 10:29

So I know that you're an excellent researcher. And so for our listeners' benefit, you've done all this research. Ultimately, you made a decision on which PMS for your motel. Which one did you go with?

Kerri Gibson 10:39

I ended up going with Muse. And the reason I went with Muse is one of the same reasons I went with my short-term rental PMS, which is Logify. And that's because of their marketplace. So not only do they have a robust PMS, but they have a marketplace of vendors that they work with that allows me to customize my tech stack for my business, which is very different from your business, which is very different from even the motel that's across the street from me and my short-term rentals that are, you know, other ones that are across from me. My business is very unique. So because of they both have powerful marketplaces, I'm allowed to build a tech stack that's best in breed. And if I ever were in the fat in the scenario where I need to change up my PMS, let's just say I outgrow it for whatever reason, or let's say one of them sells and the new owners decide to take it in another direction. I still have all the surrounding tech that I just have to take and to plug in whatever that new PMS is. And I don't have to start from scratch. And that is super, super important.

Michael Russell 11:40

Cool. So let's circle back then to you, you know, you said, okay, look, in order to be successful at driving direct bookings, it's down, it starts foundationally with having a PMS because that's kind of the central nervous system of your uh of your your campaign here, in a way. Um, so you've established, okay, I've got a PMS. What are some of the other things that you need to line up in order to be successful with driving direct bookings?

Kerri Gibson 12:06

So after TechStack, I would say one of the most important things is knowing your brand. Because if you don't know your brand and who you're going after, it's really hard to create a direct book experience that connects. Like, so you're not going, you're it's going to be hard for you to build an impactful booking experience, an impactful social media experience, an impactful paid ads experience if you don't know your brand. So if you're just, you know, a vanilla renter of 25 condos, exactly like 25 other condos right next to you, it's really hard for you to build something that's going to drive the interest because these days people want to connect with a brand. They want to connect with where they're going on vacation and understand. And so if you can't differentiate yourself, articulate that, there's no reason for them to book with you differently over the OTAs or over the person next to you, which makes fine like rationalizing the investment of time that a um direct book strategy is really hard. So I would say really know and connect with your brand.

Nathan St Cyr 13:11

Okay, so I want to comment on this because like I, this is one of my favorite reasons that we have you on. You are exceptional with connecting with your you know exactly who you're marketing to. You and I say marketing, but really I believe you look at it as who you're connecting with, like who you're going to care for because you have such a passion for hospitality. But when people are on this road of shifting from STRs and they want to scale up and purchase a boutique hotel or a motel or whatever it is, I think this is a piece that gets missed so often. We just did uh an episode that should be coming out shortly on creating that that investment thesis. And I feel like a lot of times it's missed where people don't really understand, hey, I'm purchasing this, but they're just looking at the underwriting as these numbers. They're not looking at at, okay, who, who am I, who are we marketing to and what experience are we going to create ultimately to then that has to be crystal clear so that you know how to develop your what your brand really is, what it's speaking to. And having that North Star, I think is missed a lot of times, but is a really, really critical component to moving forward with the hotel in this space. So I'm I'm so freaking pumped that you brought that up.

Kerri Gibson 14:34

Yeah, I think that often people forget about like when they're going out and looking at properties to buy, they forget about their buy box and they forget about the market that they're going after, or they're not clear on what they want it to be. So for me, I'm very clear on the customer I want to serve or the guests that I want to serve and the experience that I want to create. And so when I'm building my buy box for a property, whether it's a Motel or a short-term rental, I'm very clear on that. It's my partner, Philip, who is very clear on the underwriting models and making sure that my buy box, the properties that we're selecting that fit into the buy box, actually tick the financial boxes. So, you know, so it is a multifaceted approach because for me, the reason we are in hospitality is for love of hospitality. There are always the revenue reasons and things to do. But I truly believe that in hospitality, if you if you're passionate about who you're serving and you're authentic in who you're serving, then the money is gonna follow. Whereas if you're not building a clear experience and clear about who you want to be, it's gonna be very hard to make any investment work, whether it's a motel or a short-term rental.

Nathan St Cyr 15:49

Think can we just like can we just play that over and over and over for our listeners? Because that like that is so well said and so often missed. That was just absolute nugget. Thank you.

Kerri Gibson 16:03

You're very welcome. And it's one of the things that, like, because you and I, the with the three of us are in a mastermind together, which is how I met and connected with you guys and like just fell in love with you guys right away. Your energy, but also your vision and your passion of why you were doing it connected with me so much. And I think it's not one of those things that you can teach, but it's something you have to uncover for yourself, you know. So when I worked in corporate, one of the things that I hated the most was every time a decision was made, you know, layoffs or cutting products or whatever, the the saying was, it's not per it's it's just business, it's not personal. And that never resounded with me. And so it always made me feel a bit icky. And that's because for me, humans are at the core of everything we do. And that's what I love about hospitality, is it allows me to uncover those niches of guests that I can speak to and serve to, which is not the whole entire market.

Nathan St Cyr 17:00

I love that. So if we tie this back to we start with the central nervous system, uh property management system is selected. You selected yours for your hotel, you selected Muse because you felt like all of the other parts of your tech stack were gonna work really well with you being able to create this unique marketplace for ultimately your guests, right? And then you've you have this very clear vision of who it is that you are marketing toward towards. And so then what's the next step from that in how you're actually then creating what's next? What comes next to help somebody book directly with you?

Kerri Gibson 17:44

So the next thing you'll need to do is start building your digital presence. And so most people say start with social media, which is good, but I actually say start with your Google business profile. Because one of the most important things that you need to do in a direct book strategy is start building credibility with the search engines, with chat GPT, with, you know, and we just went through a whole experience of learning how ChatGPT is giving value, you know, ranking you. It's clear how Google ranks you, but build your Google business profile. Take ownership of that, because then you start building credibility with Google, you start establishing your brand, you start collecting reviews outside of it, and then you can start, and all these can be done side by side, but that's when you can start going into social and you have things to link out to as well. So as you build your Google profile, you have it, and then as soon as you start building your social profiles, you can link those to your Google Business profiles, which gives you more and more credibility. Then the next thing you do is you create a website, a basic website to go after your low-hanging fruit. And that low-hanging fruit is going to be your repeat guess and your referral guess. So for those guess, it doesn't have to be anything fancy. It can be a one-pager that just talks about your business, where you can start optimizing for your SEO just with an explanation of who you are, the keywords you want to use. But it's mostly around getting bookings. And again, that's where your Google profile can lead to. Google Business Profile links back to that. Because you never want your Google business profile to link to an OTA, because all you're doing is giving the OTA more credibility for your property as opposed to owning it yourself. And that is a piece of digital real estate you should own for yourself.

Michael Russell 19:39

So so, real quickly, an OTA being an online travel agency. Yes. Some examples being Expedia, Booking.com for short term rental operators, obviously, Airbnb and VRBO being the most common. But OTAs they stay in business by collecting a percentage of the revenue generated from the booking. And so what you're suggesting. is if you create your Google page and you don't have a website, then you don't have an area, you don't have a place where people can go and book direct. So you're you're automatically losing a percentage of your revenue just giving it away. Yes. These things that you've talked about so far from organizing, like choosing your your property management system, your PMS, to creating your brand and having like a presence and being an identity, then setting up your Google business page where you can start collecting specific reviews. And then ultimately all of this is effective if you have a booking system, a booking platform. I want to mention real quickly here in case there's any um uncertainty on this, but when you build a website, it's you know relatively easy to do these days with systems like either like Squarespace or Wix or there's a number of them that make it relatively easy just to have a website up and up and running. But behind the website Muse, M-E-W S, the PMS, is what actually is um collecting the bookings, collecting the the money, processing the payment, all of that. So you don't have to have a lot of experience necessarily in web development or you know design any of that. You can get started relatively quickly and get up and you know have a have a website that people start booking. And if you set up your Google page as you described then as soon as you start getting reviews and start getting credibility then people might be more inclined to just book directly rather than going to an OTA. So what I found was by doing these by by setting up what you just described, even if you're still getting people that are booking on on OTAs, they didn't even find you online yet, right? Like they weren't aware that you had a website. When they go to Airbnb or they go to VRBO and they find your listing let's say or it could be booking or Expedia you know if you have a hotel if you have a brand or a business name you know like whether your your short term rentals were Chalet's hoogah and your hotel is going to have a brand name the the being on the OTs can still be valuable because it acts as a billboard right people recognize and then what they'll do is they'll go in direct search. They'll say oh I wonder if they have a direct website let me just go see if maybe I can get a better deal or if I can just book direct and oftentimes they will but if you don't have the infrastructure that you just walk through all those critical steps which I love how you systematically went through start here, do this. It's critically important to get those in place because even if you're not ranking on Google with search engine optimization, you're still on the OTAs people will find you because you're listing there as a billboard for them to go and and find you know by locating your Google page and booking direct that way.

Kerri Gibson 22:53

Yes 100% Michael that is exactly that right there was 100% gold right there was it's a mind shift set for a mindset shift for most people to stop thinking as the OTAs booking Expedia as their as where their business comes from but start treating them as a marketing platform because that is all they are. They are a marketing platform. They are the same as Google they are the same as a Google ad. And that's how you should start to think of them. And so if you're not laying the breadcrumbs in your listings on these OTA slash marketing platforms billboards, then that's what you should start doing like start using your business name and all of the descriptions. Start making it more professional use your logo as your profile picture instead of you know a picture of you know because that is also one of the things that people are like I'm not sure what my experience is going to be when I'm booking with Carrie and Philip but hey Shelley's Uga they have a professional logo that it immediately elevates the experience that they think they're gonna have if you had the more professional and you're dropping breadcrumbs for them to go Google who you are. And even now you can just take a screenshot um of a picture on your on your OTA listing and ask Google to search for that. And it that's another way to find a direct book website. All you have to do is right click on the photo and say Google Lens find this photo and it'll take you to the direct book site. So there's a lot of ways. So making sure that your photos on your direct book site match your photos at least maybe your cover photo on the OTAs is another way that people can just find you directly yeah I didn't know that that's a good little technical hack I guess if you will that's awesome on the OTAs because I think it leads into the next kind of pillar of how I believe that Carrie's built her brand and where these direct bookings come from.

Nathan St Cyr 24:58

So let's just say that they do book through Airbnb or they book your hotel through booking.com I I have a feeling that because you are so focused on hospitality and the experience that you're going to make sure that you capture them once you have them through an OTA and that you probably have a goal to convert them into a repeat guest, a referral there you probably have a strategy put in place because you know you've served them so well. So can you kind of walk us through if that if I'm accurate there or what your strategy is absolutely yes you are 100% accurate there.

Kerri Gibson 25:42

And the ways that so first of all in order to return them into a repeat guest or someone that refers, you have to deliver an amazing experience right or you have to deliver the experience that they expect when they book the experience you've promised them in their booking. So meeting expectations but I would also argue you need to go above and beyond so that they really want to go back and talk about this exceptional experience. And that's how you build referral and repeat bookings. So that's first off if you're not providing a great experience don't ask for a review on Google. You know don't ask them to come back that's you know get all the get your house in order with that first. But then once they come in we used to when we first started leave cards in the shellets asking for people's email addresses. But as we've evolved we actually use what Stay Fi now, which is they collect so we get their information multiple different ways. Stay Fi when they're staying at the Shellet. So they have to log in it's like when you're in a motel and in order to access the Wi-Fi they have to put in their name their email address to get the free Wi-Fi. We also use a get digital guest experience platform so that as soon as they book with us, it doesn't matter if they book direct, if they book on an OTA, wherever they're coming from, they immediately have to they go over into this digital guest experience where they have to sign the contract and the agree to the rules all of those things. And then through that we are also able to collect their email address and their phone number. So we're able to go around the OTAs before they even arrive. But because at that point you're only getting the contact information of the direct booker that's where Stafi comes in and on the back end anybody who logs in at your properties you're collecting the email addresses for those as well so that you get so maybe it's two couples coming and one spouse booked but you've got three others coming and you know so first of all you're doing all the communication with this one person. Now you're able to access all of them and collect the email address for those other three people who might be future bookers and also get them into your email marketing funnels.

Nathan St Cyr 27:53

I love that now once you have them into your you just called it the email funnel so can you take us down that next step now you have collected their email they have you have collected this you know significant amount of emails as time goes on what do you do with your emails so honestly that is a huge initiative we have going on right now.

Kerri Gibson 28:18

I have hired a contractor who is actually helping us build our email funnels out to the next level because what we have right now is very basic. So we currently use MailChamp as our email campaign or as our marketing campaign database. So we currently only do email we're about to start doing text marketing as well but what they would get they would get a welcome email and then they would get a monthly newsletter and then if we had any hot promos going on or the big opening of the calendar for like the summer season's coming up the calendar's open if you want to make sure to get your spot. But other than that we didn't have a real email campaign. So to be completely transparent we're working on building that out right now but I can tell you our email strategy in everything we send is only to provide value. We never spam. So one of the things that we are clear about no matter where you find us on social media on our website and email about what our marketing pillars are. And our marketing pillars are the the chalets our properties or the motel the activities that are around the motel because we're an outdoor ski area and hiking area in the summers and then our third pillar is local businesses. So that's the three things that we talk about anytime you look at us because we know their day no matter what property property they're at starts and ends with us but the whole experience is everything that happens in between. So in order to give them a reason to come stay with us we want to show them what their amazing experience is going to be all the way around. So when we send out a communication um it will be like a monthly newsletter we have our property spotlight like something cool going on did we add a new amenity um whatever it may be then we have a a seasonal activity highlight hey here's where you go hiking and by the way this is where all the locals go these are the gems and then we have a local business spotlight like hey we've got a new restaurant that opened up or hey there's this boutique or there's this local artisan that provides you know apparel made from the alpacas on their land that type of thing. So so every single time we're communicating with them we're adding value. We'll only send them a promo like hey summer's opening up and these are the events that are going to be happening in the townships of the eastern townships where we're located this coming summer. These are the festivals that are going to happen. This is the these are like we have ultra marathons and stuff like that all the time. So we're very clear on you know this is what's going on to give them a reason to book and by the way book here now. So our unsubscribe so when we send an email we are at like a 72% open rate and oh a 10 to 12% click through rate and virtually a less than 1% unsubscribe rate. So once we get them into yes our numbers are fantastic. They're phenomenal numbers and that's because we put the value first and when we're communicating with them and then when they are ready to book with us because in our experience from the time they discover our brand to the time they book for the first time it takes six to seven touch points. And those touch points could be they found our website or they found our listing they found our social media they're on our email but we can tell it takes them five to six times to touching our brand before they're ready to book because we are a and we're in a market that's a planned booking we don't get a whole lot of last minute bookings. If we do it's like a local staycation a drive to market but it's something people are planning and thinking about so we want to keep adding value and not sell to them so that by the time they go to book it's just like oh yeah we're going to the townships and we need to book a Shelly Zuga. Like it's just we're hand in hand with the with the with the region.

Michael Russell 32:08

So I want to jump in here because this is that's a really interesting tidbit that you just described is that you're nurturing a relationship with the potential guest. A lot of times people look at email marketing as a way to nurture existing guests. I'm curious to know you know I want to reiterate you you've achieved 70% direct booking so these different methods in in which you're accomplishing this all have value but I'd like to know do you have the information on what percentage of your bookings come from repeat guests?

Kerri Gibson 32:38

I do. Of course I do so all in for the year we are at 24% of our bookings come from repeat and 6% come from referrals. So that's and this is the second year in a row that we're going to hit that we might actually exceed it because for Q3 we're actually at 40% of repeat and referrals. So we had a like significant jump during our high summer season but that's really important because that's 30% of our bookings and it's even a higher percentage of our revenue which I don't know off the top of my head but that we don't have to go looking for we don't have to convince someone to come. It's the nights we don't have to book so not only do we not have to go looking for these are guests that know what they're getting and so they tend to book further out because they want to secure the property that they want and they book for longer amounts of time. So they're my repeat guests are going to start booking their ski season in July when they when the nightly rates are the highest and my minimum nights are the highest. So I'm gonna lock them in at six plus nights at the highest rates that I have because they want to make sure they secure the property and they know the experience there exactly what they're signing up for and they want to make sure they get that because I am going to book and my highest seasons are going to book. And so it's a trifecta there. And so then not only are they doing that, but then the social credibility you get with them going out and they're talking to their friends. It's Christmas or whatever. Oh yeah, well our annual ski trip this year we're going back to the Eastern Townships and yeah we're staying at Shelly Zuga for the third time. Oh you're doing what you know and so they're they're just talking about you and they're driving higher amounts of your revenue.

Michael Russell 34:28

Yeah it's interesting to see how you tie all of that together. You know I I oftentimes get really focused on attracting new guests and all the way in which you can do so whether it's through social media or Google advertisements or social advertisements and I believe that all plays a role and I'd like to get your input on that but what you're describing is hey the low-hanging fruit is you've gone and exceeded their expectations originally. They are comfortable with you they want to come back nurture them continue to provide value to them with through um emails that are not like soliciting them but are and are providing them with input or feedback on like hey what's going on during this time of year. And so they're kind of still top of mind. And I think that is why you described in the beginning that you didn't just one day open your doors and have 70 70% direct bookings. This is something that's taken over you know three years or so to develop but it pays dividends over the long haul by executing at a high level from an operation standpoint, providing great value in terms of communication and just going on exceeding their expectations overall has has over time helped buffer your direct booking so you're not so reliant on these OTAs. And it's just the whole thing is interrelated. It's not just one little thing that you do.

Kerri Gibson 35:43

100% Michael 100% it's like it's just like weaving a tapestry weaving a rug you have to do all of the components if not you're going to have a lopsided outcome but you have to feed into all of the different aspects of building a brand you know and I would say that one of the things we didn't talk about but you know another component that you need to have to have a direct book brand is that guest experience and it needs to be refined and it needs to be honed and it needs to be defined all the way from the moment they book to the time they leave and then what happens after that because that is really so like Isaac French is amazing right and he drove he has a micro resort and all of his is driven off of Instagram or a lot of his but I don't have a unique stay like that. I have elevated stays but I I'm a ski shellet. So you know there's other ski shells like me out there. So what is it that I'm gonna do to differentiate myself and that's really in the guest experience and that's from the time they discover me till the time they come back or the time they leave and staying that top of mind. So that guest experience needs to be highly refined and highly high touch. And high touch does not mean you like automations and technology allows me to be high touch where my guests still feel very loved and cared for. And one of the comments without ever maybe never even talking to me because I've anticipated I've built their guest journey by learning from every single question that a guest asks me so that when they get once they book and they get email communications from us I've anticipated what their question's going to be and I start answering it ahead of time. So that I have guests at leave that like I feel like I made brand new friends and I never even met Carrie or spoke a word to her and Philip. But they anticipate our needs so highly and at the times they do happen to reach out to us response just like that you know like prioritizing the response because if you're not focused on your current guests then you're constantly going to be looking for new guests constantly and looking for a new guest in this market is really really hard. And I'll go back to what Nate said I want to connect with my guests. I really really do and so it's up to me to create their desire to want to connect with me.

Michael Russell 38:08

Yeah um so I I think that you've done an excellent job of outlining the importance of nurturing existing relationships and the tremendous value that brings but I do want to shift gears a little bit here. I would like to dive into some of the other avenues that you do generate leads for new guests. So namely Google right Google advertisements I know that you have figured out how to use Google or perhaps it's Facebook. Maybe you can explain how do you advertise so that you can you know get people into your pipeline of nurturing them so this is also multifaceted.

Kerri Gibson 38:47

So yes there are paid ads which I can dive into there are also collaborations with uh influencers and there is also partner marketing and I would not be successful without all three of those. So first of all I think paid advertising comes at the end of the process because you need to have a solid web presence you need to have a strong website so that when you have credibility with Google first of all and so that when you pop an ad and you drive them to your website they have that full mature experience that they're expecting because if you're paying for a Google ad and then you're driving them to a website that looks very immature or like has a lot of grammatical errors or is very basic, you're instantaneously going to lose trust. So for me, paid ads come at the like one of the last things you do in building your brand. And I used to run equally meta and Google ads and I have recently switched to running only Google ads. And the reason I did that is because and this is something I learned from Conrad O'Connell so If you're interested in building a direct book strategy, I highly suggest following him. Both Nate and I have been on their podcast before, but he opened my eyes to the fact that meta ads, Facebook, social media, that's interruptive advertising. Like they're just scrolling and you happen to pop, and maybe you get their attention. But Google, which has its place, but Google ads are intentional. It pops when they're looking for rental chalet in the eastern townships. That's very relevant. Those are customers that are going to convert faster because they're looking exactly for my product. So that's like advertising that's in sync with where they're at, where social advertising is disruptive. And maybe it'll save you or maybe they'll follow you and come back. Maybe you'll pop again or not. But to me, that was super eye-opening. And I have since shifted all of my budget as a test, I think since July, into all Google ads. And I would say I'm getting a much higher ROI on my paid ads because of that switch in strategy for me.

Michael Russell 41:02

That makes a lot of sense. What you're describing, you know, I think about when I'm looking at social, I'm scrolling, I want to see some photos of my friends. I'm kind of just like casually just like filling time, right? I'm not in the mindset of like, I want to book something right now. So to your point, it's disruptive. It's like, you know, oh, what is this ad? Get this ad, maybe I click it, and then it's just, you know, I'm not ready to book right now. I'm not in, I'm not in the mindset of booking. And so if you don't have a huge budget and you're trying to decide where you're gonna put your resources, that is a very critical point you just made. You got to be strategic on how you deploy your resources, and you may be, you know, I don't want to say wasting money, but it might not be the best use of your funds to use social advertising based on what you just described.

Kerri Gibson 41:43

And you have to tense, it also depends on where in your journey you are. And maybe you want to do social advertising because you want to build your social media following. Like maybe that's that's a goal for you, and it does make sense. And your point is not to get bookings, but your point is to get followers on your page. So that is no longer my goal, which is another reason that shift made sense for me. I I feel that um, I mean, social can always grow, but I also feel my social media strategy is strong enough now that I'm attracting followers that are gonna book. Like, so I that's not my intent anymore. So, but attracting bookings now is what I need. So that's where it made sense for me to shift to Google. So yeah, so that that's there. But again, like I say, it comes at the end of a very mature website, social Google history.

Michael Russell 42:37

I want to ask you when you're talking about developing a compelling website, when I'm listening to you, I'm thinking about what I see when I visit your site, which has excellent videography and photography. Can you walk through like how do you how do you apply excellent videography and photography to to convert? What what are some of the things that like what are the costs involved in doing so? Like what is the strategy behind that? And if you could, you know, break us down. This is like a whole can of worms, but in more of a basic level, like how have you used this strategy successfully?

Kerri Gibson 43:12

Oh my goodness, I have used this strategy so successfully. And it comes from what one of the other points I was talking about is influencers and content creators. I know so many people are scared to work with these people, but you shouldn't be. Like you should be scared about whether or not, not scared, but you should go into it with open eyes about making sure you choose the right people to collaborate with, which that's a learning experience in and of its own. But influencers and content creators have skyrocketed my my website, my social media presence, because I am not a visual content creator. I know that I'm pretty decent at written content. I enjoy it. I'm a terrible videographer, I'm a terrible picture taker. And so nothing I captured there is inspiring. So when I was very lucky to most of us that have very beautiful properties, we get tons of collaboration requests, right? And I was so so hesitant at first, but I'm glad I took the dive. So a quick masterclass and how to collaborate and choose content. So there are two reasons that you want to collaborate. And that is influencers, you want access to their audience, or content creators, you want access, you want them to give you beautiful content to use. And sometimes, if you're really lucky, you'll have the unicorn that has both the audience and the content type you want. That doesn't happen a whole whole lot, but when that happens, you should jump on it. I've had a few of those, and not only do I get beautiful content, I'll pick up a couple hundred followers at the same time of my target market. So once you identify someone whose content you want, it starts with you going out and following other patterns and seeing who they're creating with or finding other people on Instagram. But anyone you collaborate with should have a media, a media kit. They should be able to tell you who their follower is, where they're located, so you can make sure it aligns with your target, your avatar. So for example, we work with a lot of outdoors people who do hiking, biking, traveling with their dog, and they stay in cozy chalets and their audience is focused in uh Canada and New England, right? That's who's likely to come visit us. I'm more interested in someone that has 10,000 followers of that demographic than I am in someone that has half a million followers all over the world that is doing like swimsuits, you know, has its place. Here is not that place. And even if I picked up a ton of followers, what's the chances of them coming to visit me? Not very much. So I'd rather pick up 200 high-quality people that are likely to come visit me than 50,000 people that think I have beautiful properties, but they're never gonna come here for just to stay at my places, right? So that's being strategic and going after the audience, making sure if you're going after their audience, does it align to your avatar? And the other one is on content creation, does it follow the aesthetic that you're trying to create? So when you look at our website, everything is cozy, comfy in nature. And that's the so everybody I collaborate with, they love nature, they love cozy, they love, you know, that's the vibe that I'm going for. So someone, gosh, let me think, who's coming here to go on a road trip um across Canada and most of their following is in Europe. They might have beautiful stuff, but that's not my target audience, you know. So unless I want access to their content because it aligns, I'm gonna pass on that collaboration. And I'm gonna go for someone that is more regional and has an avatar that looks like mine, or that creates content that looks like mine. So that European Red Trip I might go with because I like their content, but I know I'm not gonna pick up many valuable followers, but they're gonna give me beautiful stuff to put on my website.

Michael Russell 47:12

So the right, the right content creator is key here. You've mentioned a couple of things that you want to look for that's gonna drive uh interest from your your ideal avatar. Um I'm thinking about the perspective of someone that maybe doesn't already have a hotel, but is intending on purchasing one, and they're trying to strategically put together what you've just outlined here from developing a website, identifying the right property management system, thinking about advertising on Google. The part that's a little vague to me that I feel like I would like some clarification on is in terms of identifying a budget for marketing as it relates to social media, particularly using an influencer, like what does this cost? And then how long should one expect it should take to see results? And I ask that in the context of someone who, again, has not bought a hotel yet, but is going through the process of underwriting it and trying to put together the steps to have, you know, a projection of how they can drive additional bookings, particularly direct bookings, understanding, like I said, the cost of an influencer and the timeline that it'll take to get to get results.

Kerri Gibson 48:28

So a good influencer does cost now. Gone are the days of a free stay for free content in general. For you'll still get offers of that, but it'll be people that are just starting out in their infancy of it, you know, and you might accept a couple of those, right? Because it might be okay, I can, you know, some of my best results have been from people with smaller amounts of followings. So, but a real professional content creator or someone who's amassed a good following with your avatar, they're gonna cost money. There, they're there's gonna be a cost associated with it because that's their job, because building an audience and a credible audience is a lot of work, you know. So they deserve to be paid for that. And when they choose to align with your, so think of it as brand alignment. So they should get benefit from aligning with your brand and you with theirs as well. Like, because they also get this beautiful content, but you get the content, you also get um access to their customer base, they're building credibility with their followers as well of the kind of experiences that their followers want to have. So it will cost them money. Now, as for when you start to see results, that's gonna depend on how you structure it with them. I mean, so you can they will build, they can offer you a package all the way from I'll do a few stories while I'm there to I'll have a permanent post on, you know, a carousel, a photo carousel, I will do a reel, or you could even do things like a giveaway, right? So stepping your way up the ladder. So if you're just doing content creation where they're gonna give you some content that, or they're just posting at that moment that you're not gonna be able to reuse, that's a fairly low, that's a fairly, you're not gonna get much out of that, right? You might pick up a few followers, but as you work your way up the spectrum when they become more and more expensive, you will get a higher return. And so, like your the one that's gonna cost the most but gonna give you the most immediate impact is a well-structured giveaway. And people hate giveaways. I love giveaways. I love a well-structured giveaway, and that means you're aligning with someone who has an audience that you want to speak to who creates beautiful content. That's gonna be your biggest ROI. It's gonna be the most expensive, but you're gonna pick up the most followers.

Nathan St Cyr 50:51

When you're saying most expensive, someone that's hearing this, that's in the process of purchasing a hotel, they have no idea what's relative. So, like, what is what's a range of cost from what you just went through from low end to high end?

Kerri Gibson 51:04

I would say a minimum cost is $1,000 up to $4,000 or $5,000, depending on who like if you're working with a really good content creator that has an audience that you want, you can spend around $5,000. But out of that, you're getting you said we have beautiful videos. I've got some amazing videos that came out of that. I have some amazing evergreen content. So there can really be a long game in the content you create. Some of what you see on my social media now was created three and four years ago, right? So you have this library of content that you're building up that you can reuse in different ways on your website, on your social media, and mark and advertising. So, yeah. So there is the immediate gain and there's the long-term gain. Yeah.

Michael Russell 51:53

So what I'm interpreting from you is there's a win-win here because if you are collaborating with an influencer, they may be providing value not just in a post that goes out and you see immediately value, immediate, immediate value in, but also long-term value in that you can use that content and post it onto your website and then it's just evergreen and that it lives there. And when you put it into context of, well, if I were just to go and hire a photographer or a videographer to capture this, it might cost a couple thousand dollars or more anyway, just for that piece. But in addition to allocating whatever this is, one to five thousand dollars, I'm not only getting the photography or video, I'm also getting access to everyone in this influencer's social media network. Yep. And so it is a worthwhile endeavor for someone starting out. What should one expect in terms of timeline to start seeing results in bookings? How long does that take?

Kerri Gibson 52:54

So we have I have not done a from the first touch point to when they book from us. I do know it drives bookings. I would say, again, going to the five or six, and it's not a short-term play, I would say you're looking at a six-month play on getting bookings. Um, if you're heading into high season, then you might get something sooner. Like right now, I'm about to do a collaboration with a girl that does winter retreats with her dog. She's coming this weekend. She's gonna do some content. I will actually expect to get some bookings off of that in January and February, because that's the short range. We still have time. But in general, if you're just hers, it's very specific though. If you're just doing a general like cum stay, I would say looking for the next season to start getting bookings is a good timeline. So for now to do just a general collaboration, if I started pulling in bookings for next summer, I'd be happy about that.

Michael Russell 53:49

Yeah, and I think every situation is a little bit different. You know, we've we've listened to folks that have shared that they had you know right out of the gate tremendous success. You know, perhaps they have a uh novelty property. And you know, we we met Travis Chambers, who's got this from Hulk's. He set up something like Star Wars in in the desert. And so all of that creates, you know, depending on how much you invest into an influencer campaign and what the product is that you're offering, it can have dramatically different results. Yes. Um, but in essence, what you're describing is look, set up your infrastructure, work on nurturing your email list, focus on Google advertisements over Facebook. And then if you're gonna invest into a social media influencer, look at someone who is gonna appeal to your guest avatar, not just, hey, how many followers do they have? So for me, this has been really valuable to kind of put all the pieces together. Sometimes it can feel a little overwhelming when there's all these components and it's like, wow, I'm new to this, so how do I digest all this? This, this, the way that you've kind of organized your thoughts systematically into hey, what are some actual takeaways that if someone is looking to get started, how they can really drive direct bookings and what the value is that? Uh Nathan talked about in the beginning with you know our own situation, how when you you know drive direct bookings, there's there's a dramatic financial incentive to do so. And this way you've described, I feel like I I think there's a lot of takeaways for our listeners. So on that note, uh Nathan, um, do you want to ask Kerry one last question before we go?

Nathan St Cyr 55:24

So, Kerry, if you could just have one actionable thing, that's all they can only do one. What is it?

Kerri Gibson 55:34

Google Business Profile.

Nathan St Cyr 55:36

Google Business Profile.

Kerri Gibson 55:37

Start there. It's an it's a lot to do. It's uh I talk to people, like I present on this a lot at different conferences and whatnot, but I tell people it is a multi-step strategy. So just start taking steps, baby steps. Do one thing after the other after the other. And the first thing I think you should do is a Google business profile.

Michael Russell 55:57

Love it. Awesome. Great Carrie. Thanks for having me on the show. Um, listen, if our listeners want to stay in touch with you, um, what would be the best way to do so?

Kerri Gibson 56:09

Oh, one of my favorite ways these days to stay in touch is LinkedIn. I love LinkedIn, I think it's a great place for people building uh businesses to be. But also then we have our Instagrams and Facebook and yeah, our website, which I would say Shanley Zoo got all that, but everyone's gonna be like, how do I even spell that? So hopefully I'll go in the show notes.

Michael Russell 56:31

Absolutely. Yeah, we'll put that in the show notes. Um, we'll leak through a couple other things that you mentioned. So excellent. Uh, this has been a great episode. Carrie Gibson, thanks so much for being on the show. And to our listeners, as always, please uh go ahead and um share this podcast with others. Follow us, subscribe, and thanks so much. Aloha. Aloha, and I'm not sure.